XE9005 Motionflow not very effective with the latest update.

[daz606060]

Hi all

I've narrowed down and been told some more info about how the motion settings work on Sony TV's so ignore my other thread.

On to my issue it seem that motionflow on my XE9005 (running the latest update) is not very effective even with smoothness on 5 (max) and clearness on 2 (max) I notice very little change to motion and its the same with the motionflow preset's to I only see a slight change as the most, yet when I demoed the TVs in store I noticed more of a change when changing both of the above settings and with the preset's too, but that one was running the factor default android OS without the update mine now as.

(1) Is this a software bug with all the XE9005 running this update?

(2) Is this a software bug with my tv, did something go wrong when mine updated?

(3) Is this as intended by Sony in this update?

(4) Could this be a hardware fault with my XE9005?

Regarding #(2) is there a way to reload/reapply the software update, I've already tried a full factory restore but I still have the same issues, I thinking maybe I could redownload the update, put it on to a USB drive and reinstall it from there, is that even possible?

Thank you in advance.

[Kuschelmonschter]

Might depend on the content, see here.

Also consider Film mode setting. I don't know for newer models, but on mine (2015 resp. 2016 model), it controls on which content to apply interpolation. I have to set it to High in order for interpolation to be applied to interlaced content for example.

[daz606060]

Can't use film mode because it causes problems with content that's not films, something to do with a 2:2/1080i pulldown (same issue the A1E and XE93/94 have) that loses lock which causes a strange stutters/judder issue on non film content at 25hz and 50hz and when I've tried it, it becomes unwatchable.

[Kuschelmonschter]

Don't newer models have the Auto setting in Film mode? How does this behave actually? Suppose it also does not make too wise decisions...

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daz606060 schrieb:

2:2/1080i

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Can you explain how you watch this content? Some Android app? HDMI? Built-in tuner? Is it 25i or 30i?

It makes a difference if you watch it over HDMI (if yes, which refresh rate?) or via Android TV and apps. In the latter case, the panel refreshes at a permanent 60Hz. So you will need motion interpolation for smooth 25i playback.

As for built-in tuners, Sony's channels app switches refresh rate to 50Hz for optimal PAL playback. No motion interpolation is needed in this case for 25i content.

[daz606060]

No auto option for film mode, I use sky+hd box mainly it outputs at 1080I/50hz or 720p/50hz it the same when set to either output setting.

It's also the same when using the bbc iPlayer built in and on a ps4, and with both the digital tuner and satellite tuner that are built in to the tv.

Thank you.

[Kuschelmonschter]

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daz606060 schrieb:

No auto option for film mode, I use sky+hd box mainly it outputs at 1080I/50hz or 720p/50hz it the same when set to either output setting.

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So the TV only has to do a 2:2 indeed which is fairly easy. But somehow motion interpolation, which most likely kicks in in this case when increasing the Film mode setting, has a bad influence here.

If I remember correctly, most films on Sky are 2.35:1. So they introduce black bars on the 16:9 panel. Motionflow might get into trouble with such content.

No clue, but I have seen Motionflow failing before, so it is not too much of a surprise to me. Guess you have to manually alter the setting based on source and content...

[daz606060]

Yes film mode on medium or high introduces a strange stutter/judder on normal tv programming but movies appear to play ok, the problem is not with movies/film but just about everything else.

Take a show called Mock the Week it's a comedy panel show by the bbc with 2 teams with 3 members on each team sat behind a desk, with film mode on medium or high all 3 members can move their head but only one of their heads will get this strange stutter/judder happen.

I'll try to explain this strange stutter/judder issue the best I can.

It mainly effects heads and hands they appear to speed up or slow down briefly for a second or less, sometime it appears to speed up then slow down, it can sometimes look like it's missing frames but again only on heads and hands.

It's wouldn't be a problem if the motionflow smoothness settings with film mode off or on low, worked similar to with film mode on medium or high, with film mode on medium or high I only need smoothness on 1 or 2 to stop the blur on panning shots on normal tv programs not films, but that introduces the stutter/judder issue, but with film mode off or on low I get almost no effect even with smoothness on 5 it's nowhere near the same effect you get with smoothness on 1 with film mode on medium or high.

Hope that help explain my issue it more that motionflow is broken/not very effective with film mode off, where as the demo unit I tested in-store before I purchased the tv motionflow seemed work more like you would expect ie you turned up smoothness and it smoothed the motion and that was with film mode off but I don't think that tv had been updated.

[Kuschelmonschter]

So we are only talking about content from the Sky Box, right? Source material is always 1080i, right? On time source is film based and one time it is some TV show.

IMHO, film mode determines on which content Motionflow Smoothness is applied. For interlaced content (which 1080i from the Sky Box is) it always has to be set to Medium or High or it won't do anything at all concerning motion interpolation (only BFI maybe).

I am not having your described issue with non-film content and Motionflow Smoothness (Film mode set to High). But I am not watching TV over HDMI but via Kodi app. I really need motion interpolation as TV material is 25/50fps but the display is 60/120Hz. I only sometimes get micro-judder in case the source rate is not properly detected by the motion interpolator.

In your case you have 50fps material and 50Hz refresh rate from your Sky Box. You should not need any motion interpolation to get smooth playback...

[daz606060]

It as the same behavior when the sky box it set to 720p too, I need some motion smoothing because I find panning or fast moving objects look like a horribly blurry mess.

I've not noticed it in kodi at all and do have film mode on in kodi, but today I tried the satellite tuner built in to the tv and noticed it there too.

But from what you and others have said I think it's micro stutter that I'm noticing I must just be susceptible to micro stutter I guess, I'm trying the clear preset and going to see if I can live with it or not, I've still got time to return it if I can't.

[daz606060 · Accepted solution]

After much research it now appears to just be poor quality and motion on some channels broadcasted on satellite mainly on BBC,ITV and especially Dave channels I've been to friends and family's houses and noticed it on them too when looking for it on a mixture off different boxes/tuners including Freesat HD and Sky Q so I got a bit panicky when I saw it on my new shine XE9005 thinking it was that, when really it's the feed that's at fault and the motionflow and film mode just showing it more, that's what you get when your looking to closely for faults on your new tv, just hope I can untrain myself from setting it now.